Idiotic Questions against reservations
Some fool with questionable mental acumen has raised few questions at this post I thought I will give him answers
Do you know that Dalits are different from OBCs?
Yes.. And that is why we need quotas for BCs as well. Don't you know such a simple fact. Aren’t you ashamed to exhibit your mental depravity by such questions. Do you think that we all are discussing this topic without knowing this basic difference. If not they would have asked for 49 % reservations
While OBCs, i.e shudras, though forbidden from hearing the vedas, were allowed to enter temples,
No.. They were not allowed to enter into temples. Before 19th century, the women of few communities like Nadar were not even allowed to wear blouses and have to work in fields topless. There was a social movement by Mrs.Caldwell in Tamil Nadu in the 19th century who stitched blouses for them in the western style.
Do you know that the current list of OBCs includes several well-off communities which even own land, and are often known to exploit dalits who work as labourers in their fields?
OBC has specific criteria. Please read that. And for heaven sake, do some home work before posting in other people’s blog. This is not your own blog where you can write rubbish. Contrary to popular belief/knowledge, the Mandal Commission's definition of OBC was based on 11 criteria, which covered Social, Educational and Economic discrimination. Thus, the debate about "caste-based" vs "economic criteria" is actually a non-issue. Please see the website of The National Commission for Backward Classes, for more details and for heaven sake, take care to ascertain facts before you post them in a public forum.
Yes... So we have resever 10 percent for BC and 17 percent for MBC.... Why does that worry YOU....
Do you know that the population distribution table given here according to the Mandal Commission report is based on data from a 60 year old census and an NSSO survey conducted in 1999 says that OBCs are 32% of the population?
But OBC are more than 90% in Tamil Nadu as per the FR which I can say is a very comprehensive record. How can you decide. The differences in the estimates of OBCs among different surveys (52% by Mandal Commission, 32% by NSSO, 29% by National Family & Health Survey, etc.) is not because one is more accurate than the other - but because each uses difference criteria to define OBCs.
Do you know that according to the same NSSO survey, 24% of seats in colleges withour reservations are already occupied by members of the OBC category?
Yes.. But OBC are 60 % of population and the forward castes who are a miniscuel amount of population occupy greater seats just because they got education first
Do you know that there is no concept of "creamy layer" for SC/STs, i.e generations upon generations of even the most affluent SC/STs can keep benefitting from reservations?
Yes.. We will introduce one soon
Do you know that there is now a movement even amongst SC/STs to have separate sub-quotas since many benefits are cornered by second generation reservation beneficiaries?
No Idea... Can you give the details. When are you going to develop a habit of giving facts and not writing garbish from your impressions. Learn to write a decent post with good points. The points regarding reservations are being read by the whole country and not a group of racist fanatic lectures who had given you a pass in IIM. No wonder you got sacked from IBM
MORE QUESTIONS
Would you like to go to a doctor who has cleared all her/his exams with just passing grades and managed to secure admits only due to caste certificates? R u aware that after getting certificates, they also buy their ranks and marks ? and who will very likely cure you ( of life!)
You seem to be talking about the private colleges. Why can't you undertake a strike demanding the govt to shut down private medical colleges. Can you explain please. WHy are you worried only about Caste based Quotas and not about Sponsored seats, NRI Quota, Institutional Quota, Payment seats etc
And what about the student who works really hard, and who dosent get an admission simply bcoz the seat is reserved for someone ?
Exactly and that is why we ask you to fight against Sponsored seats, NRI Quota, Institutional Quota, Payment seats etc
U think people of lok sabha and the rajya sabha ( who hav won the elections on the basis of the votes of 76% of the population) would make such decisions with a sane mind ?
Of course, they will make a decision that is good for the 76 % and not for few people. It is democracy where the welfare of 76% is more important
in some universities the professors have been known to show partiallity towards one section of students due to their caste..
Never in Tamil Nadu, (except in IIT , of course which is known for racist faculty) Please come here to know how beautifully reservation has worked
There are just around 5 top medical colleges in Tamilnadu and the total number of seats in those are less than 500
Don't be stupid. What colleges do you mean by the Top 5. Can you give the seat matrix and justify your statement
With 69% seats reserved, a student from a non-reserved category needs to score minimum of 297+/300 to get admission into any of these institutes. This puts tremendous pressure on the students and the demand exerted on them is deadly!
And the Cut-Off for
BC - 296/300
MBC - 294/300
SC - 291/300
I have spoken about the 69% reservation at this post and at this post and at this post So every one has to study, not necessarily the one from Forward Caste
The actually backward sections either cant afford the higher-education or dont reach the required cut-offs.
May be few seats in the BC Quota are got by children of doctors, but I can proudly say that in my batch of 100 there were just 5 medicos whose parents were doctors. All others were first generation doctors coming from families where the average monthly income was about Rs. 5000 But we were helped be a very low tuition fees (some Rs 4000 per year)
- It is naked truth that many get fake caste certificates to get their kids into best of colleges.
Idiotic Statement. Tamil Nadu has a very systematic verification system. All the community certificates are sent from the Medical College to the DME (Director of Medical Education) and then the copies are sent from there to 3 seperate verification
1. By the Revenue department. Enquiry is carried by the Collector for ST, DRO for SC and RDO for MBC and Tahsildar for BC
2. SBCID/CBCID who undertake a secret verification (as they do for criminals). This has caused many uneasy moments. Imagine a father being told that police were enquiring about his son or daughter some 6 months after he/she has joined in medical college. The parents immediately rush to the hostel and will be welcomed by the ward who does not know why the police is enquiring about him in his home town. One of my classmate's parents did not believe this story and even shifted the house after getting transfer
3. Social Welfare Department.
- Also parents enroll their students to rural schools for their class XII alone because students belonging to rural schools have reservation too in the state.
That Quota has been cancelled for the past 4 years. ANd again, you should have studied in the rural school from 9th to 12th to get this quota and not XII alone .
Ok so they will increase the no. of seats so that others don’t suffer. But ask all those socialists who cry hoarse about the upliftment of downtrodden whether they would rather leave their lives in the hands of those who managed to get an MBBS or an MD only because they belong to a certain section of the society, so that their social cause can be furthered.
Can you ask this question like "who managed to get an MBBS or an MD only because"
their dad had 50 lakhs to pay for Private College
their dad had links to get a Sponsored Seat
their dad worked abroad and he studied under NRI Quota
Remember that the latter 3 quotas exist for while. But you were not protesting. But you are protesting for Caste Based Quota. That shows your casteist attidude
Ask the students belonging to the reserved quota whether they would like the same to be mentioned on their engineering/ MBA degrees, so that companies can exercise that right in fullest?
How come companies choose graduates from Private management college and private engineering college. This question again proves that your are a racist fanatic. Any how I suppose that they have the same EXIT EXAM and same pass mark for both. Then how does this matter, (Except for your casteist attitude)
Many of the reserved seats in these institutes are unfilled. What about that?
I have answered this question umpteen times. Tell me the seat and I will show you the candidate.
I don't have any idea about doctors, but i personally haven't heard people going to a doctor and first enquiring about whether he has come from reserved or unreserved category. And where is the data from which people are drawing conclusion that due to reservation we are producing mediocre doctors.
Very Good. The data is in the mind. It is written in the minds of the forward caste people that the other communities are below them. And this is exactly why we need reservations
8 Comments:
-
At 8:47 PM, bumbledoor said…
-
At 7:21 AM, Doctor Bruno said…
//1. Do you know that the landed Jats in Rajasthan, the influential and powerful Yadavs in Uttar Pradesh are also OBCs?//
OK. But for this the downtrodden OBC should worry. Answer my Quuestion. Why are YOU worried for this
//2. Do you know how easy it is to make false income certificates for people who are not government servants, especially for those who are businessmen and farmers? //
I am telling this for the PAST 2 Years and this is exactly the reason why I AM TOTALLY AGAINST Economy based reservation. I request you to tell this to all the racists (like Narayana Moorthy) who are against caste based reservations, but favour economy based reservation. Please post this comment in other blogs that advocate Economy based reservation
//3. Do you know that the management quota and NRI quota are limited to private aided and unaided colleges? There is no such quota in Central government institutes.//
Yes. But Merit is diluted by these Quota. Why did not you people, who disrupt health care in the "name of merit" and nepotists who resigned from teh Knowledge commission in the name of merit did not do any thing
// 4. Do you know that most of these private colleges are owned by politicians or controlled by them through shadow boards?//
Yes. WHy are you NOT opposing them
// 5. Do you know that these are the same politicians (who have shown rare unanimity on the issue of expanding quotas in government institutes ) who won’t take the initiative to abolish these quotas because they are money spinning tricks?//
Why did not you fight against them. WHy did not Shiv Kera file a case against them in Supreme Court
// 6. Do you know that in the medical colleges the SC/STs study under the same teachers, use the same library facilities, live in the same hostels and eat the same food as upper caste students?//
That is why I am against reservations in PG (See my other posts)
// 7. Do you know that in spite of the above, these reserved category students don’t perform at par with open category in post graduate (PG) entrance exam. Access the PG exam results of AIIMS (July 2006 session) to see for yourself-//
See Tamil Nadu PG or other exams in South India and you will know that this statement is WRONG
// 8. Do you know that these exams are also open to the extremely bright and meritorious reserved category students from the state of Tamil Nadu ?//
And these exams papers are available in Lucknow and Jaipur and Delhi. Even when few candidates were caught red handed and even when Govt wanted re exam it was you people who persisted with the same fraud exam
//11. Do you know that most of the students admitted under the SC/ST quota in Central Institutes are progeny of affluent parents who have undergone schooling in the best public schools and have been tutored at the same coaching centers which you call upper class preserves?//
Yes.. And that is why we need to remove those educated class from the Quota (and not remove the Quota)
There is a tamil saying that water to paddy will trickle to the weed. For that you have to remove the weed (sons of IAS Officers) and not stop watering (remove Quota).. because when you stop watering (no quota) it is the Paddy (poor down trodden candidates) who are going to
suffer -
At 7:39 AM, Doctor Bruno said…
9. Do you know that in all India PG exams of Jan 2006 (which have no provisions for reservation) also only 30 SC/ST students could make it to the merit list of 2000? Yes. And this shows that the community has come up with reservations. Now do you know the corresponding figures 30 years ago. If you see that you will understand the reality
10. Do you know that even these exams are also open to the brilliant reserved category students from the state of Tamil Nadu ? Yes. But how many AIIMS students get a rank in All India. If you see the top 50 students enter AIIMS. And all of them should get rank in All India . Can you tell the answer to this question -
At 12:03 PM, bumbledoor said…
Dr Bruno,
I owe you some clarifications. Hope that you would keep these in mind.
//OK. But for this the downtrodden OBC should worry. Answer my Quuestion. Why are YOU worried for this//
But for you, every sane citizen of this country should be worried about this. The reason is very plain, unless you look at it with prejudiced eyes. Quotas are for empowerment of the weak and not to enable the domination of the strong.
//I am telling this for the PAST 2 Years and this is exactly the reason why I AM TOTALLY AGAINST Economy based reservation. I request you to tell this to all the racists (like Narayana Moorthy) who are against caste based reservations, but favour economy based reservation. Please post this comment in other blogs that advocate Economy based reservation//
You cannot fault a fair idea because it is difficult to put into practice. Same way as you cannot abolish democracy because people don't vote. Where there is a will there is a way. The same racist that you are vilifying has done India proud internationally. Even I can call you names because you disagree with me; but in the democracy that we are living in, I consider it far too undignified.
//Yes. But Merit is diluted by these Quota. Why did not you people, who disrupt health care in the "name of merit" and nepotists who resigned from the Knowledge commission in the name of merit did not do any thing//
Do you know that there are mostly no takers for these seats, because the degrees that they provide are worthless? Moreover, the candidates passing out from these colleges have no reservation for them in colleges of repute(i.e. govt.institutes) in PG courses. Even after doing PG from a private college they are not employed by the private sector, nor are they offered govt. jobs like the SC/STs. In effect, their degrees are useless. They practice just like unqualified quacks. Most of the private colleges involved in this medical education racket are in the Southern States flourishing under your very nose. Whenever, the MCI tries to revoke their accreditation, your very own pro-reservation netas use their influence to prevent this from happening. All these political leaders have stakes in them. WE DON"T ELECT THESE LEADERS. ITS CRAZY SOUTHERNERS WHO DO IT.PEOPLE LIKE YOU WHO ARE TAKEN IN BY THEIR HOLLOW PROMISES OF RICE AT 2 Rs AND FREE TELEVISION SETS. “Why are you NOT opposing them " holds true for you and not for us. We have been opposing every politician who places his personal interests before national good e.g. Arjun Singh. That's why no political party is supporting us (as all politicians today fit this criterion) and everyone is on your side.
Realize......
//That is why I am against reservations in PG (See my other posts)//
I haven't seen any reservation supporter opposing it. To quote from you "Why did not you fight against them ?"
//See Tamil Nadu PG or other exams in South India and you will know that this statement is WRONG//
It still doesn't answer my question because over 12000 candidates from ALL OVER INDIA sit in AIIMS PG entrance. Why should SC/ST examinees selectively underperform in this exam when you say that they have outclassed the open category in TN? Smacks of some "Grand Brahminical Conspiracy"..eh.
//And these exams papers are available in Lucknow and Jaipur and Delhi. Even when few candidates were caught red handed and even when Govt wanted re exam it was you people who persisted with the same fraud exam//
If I correctly remember, then the candidates who were disqualified for cheating in the AIPG exam 2006 were from the GREAT PROVINCE OF TAMIL NADU. The govt. wanted to jeopardize the fate of thousands because of a few dozen troublemakers from your noble state, which is setting high standards in education. Besides it was the Supreme Court- and not we - which decided to uphold the result...another conspiracy theory?
//Yes.. And that is why we need to remove those educated class from the Quota //
Even we don’t want to remove the quota. I reiterate…if a concept is not applied properly, it does not follow that the concept itself is bad. But we want a review in the system of administration of these quotas so that it benefits those whom it’s supposed to benefit. This, if you recall, is the primary demand of the "youth for equality" according to the charter of demands submitted to the court. Why is not government coming out with facts and figures in support of the quota policy, when you swear by its effectiveness?
//Yes. And this shows that the community has come up with reservations. Now do you know the corresponding figures 30 years ago. If you see that you will understand the reality//
yaa…sure 30/2000 after 60 years of reservations ...that’s an achievement. Especially when you realize that the number of candidates appearing for these exams has increased manifold over 30 years
//Yes. But how many AIIMS students get a rank in All India. If you see the top 50 students enter AIIMS. And all of them should get rank in All India . Can you tell the answer to this question//
For your kind information there are only 34 open seats in AIIMS MBBS course. It is you who are claiming that the institute graduates are the best in the country ...not I. And that’s why we have to prove our merit again in PG entrance exams, on a level playing field. In my batch out of 20 general category students who appeared, 7 got selected in AIIMS itself. There is presently no quota for AIIMS graduates(contrary to your claims in your previous posts)in PG admission ,as the SC wants merit and only merit to be the sole criterion for admission to AIIMS. -
At 8:33 AM, Doctor Bruno said…
//Quotas are for empowerment of the weak and not to enable the domination of the strong.//
You should know that the landlord's sons do not usually get into Medical colleges or IIT unless they are able to score above 90% I am talking about the situation in Tamil Nadu and not in few states (as shown by NDTV) where they write 12th Exams in their home
As such, the benefits of reservation are going to reach only the educated people like teachers, and clerks and not landlords. This is the reality in ALL SOUTH INDIAN States like Karnataka and AP where there are 50 % reservations. Remember that ALl the Software Giants of this country are run by engineers from these states and even those from North Indian States (and even Pakistan) come to south india for specialised medical treatment. hence merit is by no way compromised by reservations. And coming to OBC
1. Those who are Class I and II Officers are already excluded by the present Creamy layer criteria and hence reservation cannot make them strong as you imagine
2. THose agricultural landlords can get their kids only if those kids are able to get fairly decent marks (which they usually don't get)
Hence this fear is totally unfounded and baseless
//You cannot fault a fair idea//
Two corrections
1. You faulted
2. It is not a fair Idea
// Do you know that there are mostly no takers for these seats, because the degrees that they provide are worthless? //
REally... ALl the private colleges are running in full swing. Tell me ONE private college where there are no takers. Please give responsible answers with supportive evidence and not write whatever you like... please...
//Even after doing PG from a private college they are not employed by the private sector, nor are they offered govt. //
No. You are totally wrong. Please check those employed in Appollo or other private hospitals. And they are not barred from entering government service
// Whenever, the MCI tries to revoke their accreditation, your very own pro-reservation netas use their influence to prevent this from happening.//
How many strikes, candle light walks agiatations have YOU DELHI DOCTORS so far held against private colleges.... We in south India have protested against Private Colleges for the past 20 years and only because of our protests the colleges are under check. Can you enumerate as to whether you have gone on a strike against these private colleges. Please give proof ....
And finally, when you ask for the performance of SC/ST in All India, can you tell me the ranks of thos eudnergraduates from AIIMS in this all india
Show the rank of the self proclaimed merit candidates please -
At 8:37 AM, Doctor Bruno said…
//yaa…sure 30/2000 after 60 years of reservations ...that’s an achievement. Especially when you realize that the number of candidates appearing for these exams has increased manifold over 30 years///
Definetely because you have supressed them for 2500 years and continue to supress them even today through mass media and with the help of few racists ...
This is really a great achievement which they have achievement inspite of all these supressions
And the so called merit students from AIIMS cannot get ranks in All India
----
1. WHere as question paper released in 2002
2. Where was people caught copying with cell phones in 2004
In 2006
The government was ready for re exam. The govt wanted to have only meritorious candidates in the list
But that was spoiled by few guys (of questionable merit, who probably used the Lucknow or Delhi technique and were not caught) who were sure that they will not get the same rank again if they are to attend another exam with strict guidelines and hence argued against re exam -
At 12:48 AM, Ecacofonix said…
This post has been removed by a blog administrator.
Posts
Dr Bruno,
Some questions of my own –
I hope you would answer them.
1. Do you know that the landed Jats in Rajasthan, the influential and powerful Yadavs in Uttar Pradesh are also OBCs?
If you know the above, then you would know that they would also enjoy the spoils of reservation, if the policy is implemented in its present form.
2. Do you know how easy it is to make false income certificates for people who are not government servants, especially for those who are businessmen and farmers?
3. Do you know that the management quota and NRI quota are limited to private aided and unaided colleges? There is no such quota in Central government institutes.
4. Do you know that most of these private colleges are owned by politicians or controlled by them through shadow boards?
5. Do you know that these are the same politicians (who have shown rare unanimity on the issue of expanding quotas in government institutes ) who won’t take the initiative to abolish these quotas because they are money spinning tricks?
6. Do you know that in the medical colleges the SC/STs study under the same teachers, use the same library facilities, live in the same hostels and eat the same food as upper caste students?
7. Do you know that in spite of the above, these reserved category students don’t perform at par with open category in post graduate (PG) entrance exam. Access the PG exam results of AIIMS (July 2006 session) to see for yourself- http://www.aiims.edu/aiims/events/result/aiimspg-jul06.htm.
8. Do you know that these exams are also open to the extremely bright and meritorious reserved category students from the state of Tamil Nadu ?
9. Do you know that in all India PG exams of Jan 2006 (which have no provisions for reservation) also only 30 SC/ST students could make it to the merit list of 2000?
10. Do you know that even these exams are also open to the brilliant reserved category students from the state of Tamil Nadu ?
11. Do you know that most of the students admitted under the SC/ST quota in Central Institutes are progeny of affluent parents who have undergone schooling in the best public schools and have been tutored at the same coaching centers which you call upper class preserves?
ANY ANSWERS?